Artistic Director and CEO of Pagrav Dance Company, Urja Desai Thakore is a pillar for the dance and cultural community. A powerhouse in advocacy, her expertise as a cultural leader has secured her accolades such as guest choreographer for BBC Young Dancer in both 2015 and 2022 and winner of the Eastern Eye Award for Dance in 2023.
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| Photo by DanceWest |
A huge advocate for South Asian dance in the UK, Urja's vocation infuses history with movement. She has platformed classical Indian dance through productions, teachings, and wellbeing initiatives including introducing traditional dance practice to benefit cancer patients, survivors and carers.
We caught up with Urja to learn more about her career to date.
You are the Artistic Director and CEO of Pagrav Dance Company. Could you tell us about what the name Pagrav means to you?
“Pagrav” has always held a deep, personal resonance for me. Literally, it means ‘the sound of feet’ but for me it speaks to something far more expansive. It captures the journey that begins with the dancer’ very first step — the connection of the sole to the ground — and evolves into a profound dialogue between the body, the spirit, and the art form.
“Pagrav” has always held a deep, personal resonance for me. Literally, it means ‘the sound of feet’ but for me it speaks to something far more expansive. It captures the journey that begins with the dancer’ very first step — the connection of the sole to the ground — and evolves into a profound dialogue between the body, the spirit, and the art form.
As the founder/ Artistic Director/CEO of Pagrav Dance Company, the name symbolises the path from sole to soul: a journey of rhythm, discovery, and transformation. It reflects the heartbeat of our work — honouring tradition while continuously moving towards new creative horizons. Pagrav is not just a name; it is the echo of our intentions, our stories, and our collective artistic journey.
You studied civil engineering before embarking on a career in dance. How did you make that decision and what was your thought process like?
I never set out with the intention of becoming a professional dancer. What I did know, even from a young age, was that I never wanted to stop dancing. Interestingly, my first dream was to become a doctor—I even cleared my pre-medical entrance exam, but I didn’ manage to secure a place in medical college.
I never set out with the intention of becoming a professional dancer. What I did know, even from a young age, was that I never wanted to stop dancing. Interestingly, my first dream was to become a doctor—I even cleared my pre-medical entrance exam, but I didn’ manage to secure a place in medical college.
My next passion was architecture and the beauty of structures and construction, so I went on to study civil engineering. For a period of time, I was doing everything at once: practising as a civil engineer, dancing, teaching dance, and pursuing my artistic interests with equal dedication.
Eventually, I reached a point where I had to choose what to pursue more fully. And when I listened to myself honestly, the answer was very clear. Dance felt closest to who I truly am. It was the place where I felt most connected, most expressive, and most alive. That clarity made the decision for me — dance wasn’t just something I did, it was the path that felt like home.
What are some philosophies or life lessons that you have gleaned from civil engineering and from Kathak dance?
Both civil engineering and Kathak have taught me philosophies that shape not just my work, but my life. The first is that your attitude determines your path. In both fields, I’ve faced challenges and moments of uncertainty, yet I’ve always held on to optimism. Even when life threw negativity my way, choosing to stay positive helped me keep moving forward.
Civil engineering taught me that anything can be created or re-created in multiple ways. There is never just one solution, one design, or one approach. Kathak mirrors this beautifully: a movement, an emotion, a rhythm can be explored through countless interpretations. That sense of creative possibility has stayed with me.
Another profound lesson is that nothing meaningful is built alone. A structure stands because of the labour, skill, and dedication of many people. Dance is the same. A performance, a company, an artistic journey — they are all shaped by a collective. Teachers, musicians, collaborators, students, audiences — they all contribute to the final architecture of the art.
In a way, civil engineering taught me how things stand, and Kathak taught me why they move. Together, they have grounded me in gratitude, collaboration, and an ever-expanding vision of what can be created when people come together
What qualities does a Kathak dancer need to have?
Technically, a Kathak dancer needs a strong understanding of rhythm, musicality, and the rich history and lineage of the art form. These foundations allow the dance to be approached with authenticity and depth.
Technically, a Kathak dancer needs a strong understanding of rhythm, musicality, and the rich history and lineage of the art form. These foundations allow the dance to be approached with authenticity and depth.
But beyond technique, the qualities that make any dancer truly flourish are much more human: hard work, perseverance, belief in oneself, humility, and a constant readiness to learn. Kathak, like any classical art, asks for commitment and patience. You must be willing to refine, repeat, and rediscover.
A good Kathak dancer is someone who remains grounded in tradition, yet open in spirit — someone who works diligently, learns continuously, and approaches the art with sincerity and respect. These qualities make the dance come alive.
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| Photo by Saloni Saraf |
You’re passionate about teaching dance. What do you think learning Kathak dance can bring to young people?
I’m deeply passionate about teaching because I’ve seen how learning Kathak can shape young people in meaningful ways. Beyond the beauty of the art form, Kathak instils discipline — the kind that comes from consistent practice, patience, and commitment.
I’m deeply passionate about teaching because I’ve seen how learning Kathak can shape young people in meaningful ways. Beyond the beauty of the art form, Kathak instils discipline — the kind that comes from consistent practice, patience, and commitment.
It also builds coordination and a remarkable ability to multitask: keeping track of rhythm, movement, expression, and spatial awareness all at once. This sharpens both the body and the mind.
Kathak encourages a strong sense of awareness — of oneself, of others, and of the environment. Young people learn to listen deeply, to focus, and to express themselves with confidence and sensitivity.
Ultimately, Kathak gives them a foundation of resilience, creativity, and self-belief that they can carry into every part of their lives.
You’ve created choreography for Sāvitri, an opera by English composer Gustav Holst, which is based on the Mahābhārata – a Sanskrit text. What do you find valuable about such cross-cultural collaborations?
These collaboration are extremely valuable to me. They require an openness — a willingness to listen, to understand different artistic languages, and to find the spaces where they naturally meet.
Working across cultures allows the art forms to expand beyond their usual boundaries. It gives us the chance to integrate different aesthetics, ideas, and approaches while still honouring the essence of each tradition.
These collaboration are extremely valuable to me. They require an openness — a willingness to listen, to understand different artistic languages, and to find the spaces where they naturally meet.
Working across cultures allows the art forms to expand beyond their usual boundaries. It gives us the chance to integrate different aesthetics, ideas, and approaches while still honouring the essence of each tradition.
Such projects also allow us to connect with a wider and more varied audience. Someone who comes for the opera may discover Kathak for the first time, and someone drawn to Indian classical dance may encounter Western classical music in a new way.
For me, this exchange enriches everyone involved. It keeps the art forms alive, evolving, and relevant — and it reminds us that creativity grows most powerfully when cultures come together with respect and curiosity.
Are there additional considerations when working cross-culturally?
Yes, definitely, honesty is essential — being truthful about what you know, what you don’t and what you are bringing into the collaboration.
Yes, definitely, honesty is essential — being truthful about what you know, what you don’t and what you are bringing into the collaboration.
Respect and sensitivity are equally important. You have to understand the cultural context of the other art form, its history, its aesthetics, and the values that shape it. This creates a foundation of trust and prevents assumptions or misunderstandings.
Clear communication is vital too. When artists from different traditions come together, we may use different vocabularies or processes, so taking the time to listen and articulate intentions becomes part of the creative work.
And finally, humility. Cross-cultural collaboration works best when everyone remains open, curious, and willing to learn from one another. When approached this way, the process becomes enriching for all involved and allows the art to flourish in new and meaningful ways
What kinds of stories do you hope to tell through your art?
Through my work, I hope to tell stories of today — stories that reflect the world we live in and the experiences we are navigating right now. They usually begin from a very personal point of origin: my own observations, emotions, or reflections on society.
Through my work, I hope to tell stories of today — stories that reflect the world we live in and the experiences we are navigating right now. They usually begin from a very personal point of origin: my own observations, emotions, or reflections on society.
From there, I’m interested in exploring human emotions in all their complexity. Although the starting point may be personal, the aim is always to reach something universal. I want to tell stories that resonate with everyone, because at our core, humans are the same despite where we come from.
I’m drawn to the subtleties of modern life — how we behave, what we struggle with, what we celebrate, and how we connect or drift apart. Translating these into movement allows the work to feel relatable and honest. Ultimately, I want my art to spark recognition, conversation, and a deeper sense of our shared humanity.
Other than Kathak dance, are there forms of art that you find complement your practice and inspire you as an artist?
Kathak is the form I have trained in for years, and I've always danced various Indian folk styles as well. In many ways, all the movement I create ultimately comes from Kathak, because that is the language I know most deeply — it’s the vocabulary my body naturally speaks.
Kathak is the form I have trained in for years, and I've always danced various Indian folk styles as well. In many ways, all the movement I create ultimately comes from Kathak, because that is the language I know most deeply — it’s the vocabulary my body naturally speaks.
But inspiration is something much wider. I find myself influenced by everything I see: the movement of nature, the rhythm of daily life, the pedestrian patterns of people walking, pausing, interacting. These everyday gestures often spark ideas, shapes, or emotional textures that flow back into my work.
So while Kathak remains the core of my practice, the world around me constantly complements it. Nature, human behaviour, architecture, music — all of these become sources of inspiration, enriching my artistic voice and keeping the work alive and evolving.
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| Photo by Simon Robinson |
How has the arts landscape evolved over the years since you arrived in the UK in 2003?
When I arrived in the UK in 2003, everything was grouped under the single label of 'South Asian dance'. There was an expectation that if you were doing South Asian dance, it had to look and feel a certain way — a very fixed idea of what the work should be. I’ve always struggled with term-South Asian Dance, because I have only ever identified my practice as Kathak, a classical art form with its own history, technique, and identity.
When I arrived in the UK in 2003, everything was grouped under the single label of 'South Asian dance'. There was an expectation that if you were doing South Asian dance, it had to look and feel a certain way — a very fixed idea of what the work should be. I’ve always struggled with term-South Asian Dance, because I have only ever identified my practice as Kathak, a classical art form with its own history, technique, and identity.
Although there is now a bit more openness, the landscape still often treats all Indian classical art form, where people still calls it South Asian Dance as one category. Kathak is still not always recognised independently as a classical discipline.
Many of the challenges from the early years remain. Opportunities were few then, and even today, some of the engagement still feels like a tick-box exercise rather than meaningful support. We also continue to face a major gap in infrastructure — there simply aren’t enough pathways or systems in place to encourage dancers to take up Kathak full-time or to build sustainable careers.
That said, awareness has definitely increased, and conversations around Indian classical forms have become richer. We are moving in the right direction, slowly but surely. But there is still a great deal that needs to happen before Kathak — and other classical forms — receive the recognition, support, and depth of understanding they truly deserve.
What are your hopes for the future of Kathak dance and of the UK arts sector in general?
My hope for the future of Kathak is that it will one day receive the same recognition and respect as Ballet — not in comparison, but in terms of visibility, understanding, and value within the wider arts sector. Kathak is a classical form with depth, structure, and lineage, and it deserves an infrastructure that reflects that: proper training pathways, full-time opportunities, supportive institutions, and a thriving artistic ecosystem.
My hope for the future of Kathak is that it will one day receive the same recognition and respect as Ballet — not in comparison, but in terms of visibility, understanding, and value within the wider arts sector. Kathak is a classical form with depth, structure, and lineage, and it deserves an infrastructure that reflects that: proper training pathways, full-time opportunities, supportive institutions, and a thriving artistic ecosystem.
For the UK arts sector more broadly, I hope to see a landscape where all classical forms — including Kathak — can flourish without being marginalised or reduced to cultural categories. A sector that invests in long-term development rather than short-term projects, and one that nurtures artists so that they can build sustainable careers.
Ultimately, I envision a future where Kathak has a strong, vibrant presence in the UK: where young dancers feel encouraged to pursue it professionally, where audiences understand its richness, and where the art form can continue evolving while still honouring its roots
If you could travel back in time to give advice to your child self, what would you say?
This is a very tough question, because I truly wouldn’t change anything. I am who I am today — my values, my ethos, my resilience — because of the choices I made and even the mistakes along the way. But if I could whisper something to my younger self, I would say this:
This is a very tough question, because I truly wouldn’t change anything. I am who I am today — my values, my ethos, my resilience — because of the choices I made and even the mistakes along the way. But if I could whisper something to my younger self, I would say this:
Trust that God has a plan for you. Don’t fight with yourself so much. Be kind to your own journey. Work hard, stay honest, and stay true to who you are — everything will unfold in its own time.
Knowing that would have made certain moments easier, but I also recognise that every challenge shaped me into the person and artist I am today.
Finally, please tell us how we can follow your work and find out about future performances.
You can follow my work and stay updated about future performances through Pagrav Dance Company’s website: www.pagravdance.com. We also share regular updates, behind-the-scenes moments, and announcements on our social media platforms —
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/urja76/
https://www.instagram.com/pagravdanceco/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pagravdanceco
YouTube: @ThakoreU
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